Building Confidence and the Importance of Early Intervention with Emily Griswold

·

Emily Griswold of Left of Center joins us to discuss the need for creating safe environments and accommodations, as well as the power of embracing one’s uniqueness and interests. We also share personal experiences and insights into coping strategies for addressing challenges faced by neurodivergent individuals.

Find more of Emily online at eleven11wellness.com or on linkedin.

The Importance of Early Intervention for Neurodivergent Children

Emily shares [beginning at 00:04:42] a three-pronged approach focused on achieving freedom through the development of emotional and social skills, executive functioning skills, and mentor support. She emphasizes that having a supportive adult relationship is crucial for success, as is understanding and navigating one’s neurodivergence. By fostering these skills and leveraging executive functioning skills to pursue personal goals, individuals can achieve greater freedom and break free from societal constraints that aim to keep them small and boxed in.

How Building Confidence can Significantly Impact Development

Emily discusses how building confidence in neurodivergent children significantly impacts their development by enabling them to better navigate social and emotional challenges, understand and accept their neurodivergence, and improve their executive functioning skills. Confidence helps these children feel more capable and motivated, leading to greater independence, resilience, and the ability to pursue their goals despite societal barriers. Her work with leaders and children alike is focused on individual co-created support plans that allow each individual to build their confidence through small actions and larger projects.

The Role of Mentors in Providing Support for Neurodivergent Children

Emily emphasizes the critical role of mentors in supporting neurodivergent children, highlighting that having one supportive adult relationship significantly increases their chances of success. Mentors provide guidance, understanding, and encouragement, helping children navigate their unique challenges and fostering their emotional and social skills. This support system is essential for building confidence and achieving personal goals, ultimately leading to greater independence and fulfillment.

Strategies for Fostering Social and Emotional Skills

Emily shares that her strategies for fostering social and emotional skills in neurodivergent children involve creating a supportive environment where they can understand their unique brain functions and how these affect their emotions and motivations. She focuses on building self-awareness, promoting acceptance of neurodivergence, and providing practical tools to manage social interactions and emotional responses. Emily also highlights the importance of patience and practice in developing these skills, ensuring children feel empowered and understood as they grow.

The Long-Term Benefits of Timely Interventions for Neurodivergent Children

Emily highlights the long-term benefits of timely interventions for neurodivergent children, emphasizing that early support helps them develop essential social, emotional, and executive functioning skills. This foundation leads to improved self-confidence, greater independence, and better overall well-being. Early interventions also enable children to better understand and manage their neurodivergence, reducing future challenges and fostering a more successful and fulfilling life.

Click here to view the transcript of this episode.

[00:00:00] Ela Miranda: Holi Holi, and welcome to Building Blocks and Puzzle Pieces. This is a Rain or Shine podcast, and I am your host, Ela Miranda. I’m so excited to welcome you here under our umbrella and to dive into how to build your own accommodations, the building blocks you need to get there, and the puzzle pieces that you might need to solve along the way.

[00:00:18] I am here with Emily Griswold, left of center, and I am so excited for y’all to hear what we have to share today. So, Emily, why don’t you go tell us a little bit about yourself and the work that you do.

[00:00:34] Emily Griswold: By saying that I am a self proclaimed and very proud weirdo. It’s my favorite title that I begin with. I am a fur mom to so many great cats and a dog, and I have an extra one today. I have an extra dog today in my house. We are always accepting extra fur children. I’m a partner, I’m a friend, and I’m a really sensitive human.

[00:01:01] And I like to start by saying that rather than like the things that I do for labor, because sometimes I know for me that I was raised in a society where, yeah, you always start with like my achievements are. So I started saying that because I, as much as I love the work that I do, and you’re going to hear me jabber for a long time about the work that I do. I’m also a whole human and I have, I do the dishes, which I don’t hate. So that’s cool. But Cor-, I know, right. It’s just a hot tip.

[00:01:35] Ela Miranda: An accomplishment right there. Like, already you’re higher in my esteem, so.

[00:01:41] Emily Griswold: And I also don’t hate laundry. I know it’s weird. It’s I know. I know.

[00:01:45] I’m it’s soothing to me. Okay, we’ll get there anyway. So then what do I who am I? What do I do? So I was a teacher for a really long time mostly special education in the district of Columbia public schools, which is Washington DC. And in the United States Capitol, it’s a very interesting place.

[00:02:04] And after many years in the classroom, I decided to leave in 2019 and start my own thing. Originally my first business was called 1111 wellness, and that was specifically directed at taking care of school staff. Mostly because I felt like. I mean, public education is failing everyone. But I felt like the first step I could try to help was my fellow colleagues who were burning out and quitting and yelling at kids even though they didn’t want to.

[00:02:30] And then I loved that and I love that work still, but I really miss working directly with with Children and young people. So I’ve always had some kind of student on the side of some sort. And officially over the summer, I launched my business left of center, which is aimed at coaching neurodivergent teens in the areas of success and competence.

[00:02:54] And yeah, I get to hang out with. little versions of me which makes me really happy and we get to do cool projects and I get to show, get to show them all the evidence of how great they are. And teach them how to love laundry just like me.

[00:03:16] Ela Miranda: I love it.

[00:03:18] Emily Griswold: I’m on a mission to make laundry fans and laundry cool again, I guess maybe that’s my, maybe that should be my tagline.

[00:03:27] Ela Miranda: I mean, there’s like immediately some resistance that comes up to that for me, but like that probably just means that I also need the work that you are doing, so good job.

[00:03:38] Emily Griswold: Well, great.

[00:03:42] Ela Miranda: Yeah no, I love that comment though about like getting to work with like little versions of yourself, right? And I think a lot of people listening can relate to that as well because I think for a lot of entrepreneurs and people who end up starting businesses, right? You tend to choose things that you love because It’s something that was a hard one lesson for you, right?

[00:04:08] I know a lot of the systems work that I do is something that I absolutely could have used, especially because so much of it is based around accommodations. And advocating for myself and learning those lessons early on would have made such a huge difference. I love to hear that you are Supporting people in that. So what are some of the biggest building blocks that you help your clients, these teens put into place so that they can advocate for their own accommodations?

[00:04:42] Emily Griswold: So I have like kind of a three pronged approach and I, whenever I describe this to people, I love to speak like first to my visual folks because I love to paint pictures with the words that I say. So picture me this. If you’re driving, don’t close your eyes. But if you are in a place where you can think of like an intertwining circle and in the middle, I want you to picture the word freedom.

[00:05:06] Because that’s where we’re trying to get to and then on the outside of that circle and they all kind of interconnect and they blend the colors blend together because you can’t have one without the other. There are emotional and social skills, executive functioning skills and mentor support.

[00:05:25] And the reason why I pick those three things is because first research says that if you have one supportive adult relationship in your life. That you were like, I mean, this is not the real number, but I like to say 1, 700 times more likely to, to do the thing that you want to do, but also to be successful in our culture, which can sometimes be deemed being able to be financially independent, live in a place that feels supportive for you, work at a job that fills you up, which is something I want for all of my neurodivergent kiddos. The second the social and emotional skills, you know, part of neurodivergence is navigating the way your brain works.

[00:06:08] And one thing I’ve noticed is that I’m so grateful this generation is way more fluid of their acceptance of their neurodivergence. Like it’s a conversation. I mean, I’m That word was like, what are you talking about when I was younger? But now it’s that’s common. Everybody knows the word neurodivergent. A lot of people don’t know really what it means, but that’s okay.

[00:06:30] We’ll get there later. But I think the part we’re missing is that it’s one thing to claim that but it’s a different thing to understand what it means and how it impacts motivation and energy and mood and You know, whatever. There’s so many things that impacts. And so having that piece to help, you know, folks understand, like, this is why you feel so exhausted when you leave school and you have to take a two and a half hour nap.

[00:06:55] This is why, you know, the you switch tabs on your computer like a rabbit bunny when you’re trying to get your homework done. And then the last part of this is the executive functioning piece, right? So. That word is thrown around a ton. And I think, I’m very careful about how I use it. Cause I think it can be definitely a tool for like socializing people into a box.

[00:07:20] And I use it. The reason why I keep the word freedom in the middle of that circle is because executive function can be a tool to get more free. It doesn’t have to be a tool of like. You know, plan your calendar down to the 3 second mark, or, you know you have like 75 container store organization bins for your kitchen, like it’s executive functioning can be a tool to, you know, work toward a goal that you’ve always wanted to accomplish.

[00:07:51] It can be the thing that helps you, you know, start your makeup line or raise money for squirrels. Which I have done. We’ll talk about that in a minute. But those are really, those are the building blocks. Like those three pieces are what build my ultimate goal, which is freedom. Because I think, not I think, I believe that we live in a society and a culture that is determined to keep certain people small and in a box and certainly not free.

[00:08:19] And so my job is to facilitate freedom. And that’s how I do it.

[00:08:25] Ela Miranda: I love that. I really just need to know the story about the squirrels though. Okay.

[00:08:34] Emily Griswold: People are like, wait, what? So yeah, here’s the story. And for those of you listening, like, I hope that this releases something in your inner child that you may not have gotten a chance to explore because it’s certainly and that’s like you mentioned the beginning. So much of this is like a reclamation for me.

[00:08:53] And and I it’s that’s my favorite part of the work is like is I embrace even more weirdness every session that I do with a teenager. Yeah. So I have one particular student that I’ve been working with now for over a year. And this student is on the autism spectrum and has been formally diagnosed, but just as a mention, I work both with formal and folks who self diagnose because all of those things matter and are relevant.

[00:09:19] And this friend has always just had a real affinity for squirrels. Like he just, which I think is beautiful because If you’re listening from the U. S., like to us, they’re kind of like rodent y. They’re not very accepted as like a cute part of our culture. And they are, they’re very adorable, but he’s really latched onto their importance in our ecosystem.

[00:09:41] And he just notices them, which I think is wonderful. And so he, the reason that his parents, decided to start working with me is he was really struggling in school socially. He was having a hard time, you know, navigating and managing most interactions and situations. There were, there were some like maturity pieces too, where, where he was, you know, still interested in things that were quote unquote, not of his age level.

[00:10:11] And so kids were having a hard time relating to him. And then some of the typical things like his backpack was a mess and like, you know, it’s like, Not brushing his teeth or whatever. Right. So like the typical things that I’m used to working with. So we started working together and the, my philosophy with young people and with adults really is I call it, put it, putting black beans in brownies.

[00:10:33] So I don’t know if you’ve ever like seen this like ridiculous, like, quote unquote, mom hack where they like, yes. And then I put black beans and my kids now love vegetables. That’s what I do with kids. So I find out what they really love and what they’re very passionate about. And we work that into the skills that they need to be building.

[00:10:54] So he was all into squirrels and I was like, we’re going in on squirrels. And so we came up with like. How, you know, how do we raise awareness so more people care about them? How do we support injured squirrels? And we actually found a rescue organization who specifically bring squirrels back to health, like baby squirrels and adult squirrels.

[00:11:18] And it was great. And I was like, thank God this exists. And so the plan was, he was like, I want to raise money for them. So that they can keep doing their work. And I want to, you know, raise awareness for them so that more people know what they do and so on and so forth. So then we took a second thing he loves, which is chocolate ice cream, because who doesn’t.

[00:11:38] And we decided to come up with an ice cream stand. So we built a business model. We came up with a logo. He designed the menu. He learned how to make ice cream from scratch. And We had an ice cream stand over the summertime and yeah. For the squirrels, wild, wild, like project idea. But while we’re doing this, I’m teaching him how to have a direct conversation one on one with a customer, right?

[00:12:14] So we’re practicing, okay, this person’s going to come up. What are you going to say? How are you going to greet them? Right? We’re talking about how to navigate a grocery store. So he went shopping for the first time. This is the second year we’ve done it. So this year. He had to do chores in order to raise money, to be able to go get the material.

[00:12:33] So like staying consistent with, you know, taking care of a space and feeling proud of, you know, whatever. So it was, that was such, I love telling that story because that’s exactly the work that I do is that we take what you’re already good at. We show you how good you are at it. And then we give you the chance to put it on a stage because you deserve to be free in front of other people.

[00:13:02] And the cool part is, is that now he has so much evidence. Like I am capable of interacting one on one with people. I can talk about the things that I enjoy on a, like in an age appropriate conversation, right? I can share about something I’m passionate and a project that I worked on. And now this kid, I randomly get a text the other day that he’s on the news at school, just like, and I go to his next session.

[00:13:31] I was like, were you going to tell me? He’s like, yeah, it was fine. But that’s a correct response to Oh, of course I can be on the news. I ran an ice cream stand. This is like, this is cake. And I’m like as I’m like sobbing, like, Oh my god, I’m so proud of you. And he’s like, leave me alone. So that’s the squirrel story. And the squirrel, and the, the, the Wildlife Foundation was so fantastic.

[00:13:58] We ended up Zooming with them and they showed us like they were feeding a baby squirrel, and it was, yeah, it was adorable. So,

[00:14:06] Ela Miranda: Oh my god. That is so incredible. I love to, like, I love your entire approach, first of all. I love that we, like, have very similar approaches. Like, it’s always really fun to me to see, when other people also focus first on what you’re doing well and the things that you’re passionate about. Because I think that’s something that is just not often taught, especially to neurodivergent people, right?

[00:14:36] This world is so focused on negativity, and, like, humans in general have a negativity bias, and so it, like, it makes sense, right? But these are not, like, the systems that I think are built with our well being in mind. So, A, love that. B, I also love, too, this idea that, like, there’s always gonna be somebody else out there who cares about the things that you care about.

[00:15:02] Like, you know, It’s so funny because my, my grandma has like a huge garden and she has like bird feeders everywhere and she loves them. And so like squirrels are her like arch nemesis. So like, I accidentally grew up with like that conditioning, right? But then we moved to Arizona where like there are no squirrels.

[00:15:23] And so I go to camp in the summer and there are squirrels in the pine trees. And I’ve missed it so much.

[00:15:30] Emily Griswold:My student would be so proud of you and your growth. He really

[00:15:36] Ela Miranda: yeah. So but yeah, you know, like, I, I just love the idea that, like, when you have, like, the language to be able to talk about the things that you care about, there are always going to be people out there. Like, you’re never alone in the things that you care about. I just, I love that so much.

[00:16:02] Emily Griswold: I do too.

[00:16:02] Ela Miranda: My next question for you is maybe a little bit of a hot topic here. but I’m, I’m curious to know, like, as you’ve been building this business and like, as you’ve been moving into this. Sort of like new pathway, right? Working with different clients. What building blocks have you put in place to support yourself as a care worker?

[00:16:31] Emily Griswold: Thank you. So funny because I was at a school yesterday and this is like burnout time. So for folks listening, we’re like right around holiday quote unquote season, which of course our country is like so much joy and 90 percent of the population is like so much pain and grief and loss and of course none of us recognize that and also they’re in public schools so like That’s a dumpster fire within itself.

[00:16:57] And I was just walking around having conversations with people who are just totally burnt out. And somebody said to me, they’re like, Oh my gosh, like we’re all just like dumping on you. Like, what do you do for yourself? That’s like, great question. So therapy is step one, like non negotiable. And a fantastic therapist.

[00:17:16] Like I can’t, I literally cannot say enough good things about my therapist. And I’m so grateful because We also live in a time where like access to quality therapy is like literally finding a needle in a haystack. So I’m, Oh my gosh. I like praise my therapist after every session. And he’s like, it’s just my job.

[00:17:36] Like, and I’m like, I don’t care. You need to know how much. So that’s a first place. Second, building blocks of care of my animals. It’s why I talk about them. Like, I’m, I don’t know what I would do, but I don’t. I don’t know how people live without alive things in their home, but I certainly can’t do it.

[00:17:53] It’s just like such a source of joy and, and the unconditional love, like there’s nothing you could do to make them not love you. Well, I’m sure there are some things, but in this house they are spoiled, so they’re just fine with their life. Outside time, especially with my partner. Like I. I try to, as often as possible, be outside with the dog at least once a day.

[00:18:17] We live really close to a really big park in the city and she’s a hound dog. So she could just sniff for the rest of her life and be totally cool. And it’s actually good because she goes slow and that helps me slow down. She’s the sniffer of all things. And, you know, of course there are times where I’m like trying to get my heart rate up.

[00:18:36] And my dog is like, sorry, we have. There’s pee all over here. I have to sniff. So you’re gonna have to wait. And then the other thing for me, and this is why I think I work so well with teenagers because I’m a work in progress. Like, I don’t have and I tell them that like, I’m one step ahead of you, if that.

[00:18:55] Some days I’m probably a step behind you, especially this generation who is like, so open, accepting and loving to like, the pieces of their identities. I’m like, I’m behind. But I think my schedule is a huge building block for my success. Right? So looking at having time carved out to do the things that I love, whether that’s read or I love TV.

[00:19:18] Like I am a child that grew up in the early two thousands and TV was an important part of my being raised. So like great TV. food. I love food so much. It’s, it’s amazing. It’s, yeah, I’m not a, what is it called? Like eat to live for that every meal. I’m like, how can I have the most delicious thing? Yeah, food is a big one for me. And then the last and the most consistent thing I do is I have a really intense morning routine. My partner knows, like, do not disturb. And it is it’s really for, you know, as a person who is born with a

[00:20:04] Biological tendency for anxiety and, you know, substance abuse and a lot of other pieces. Being in tune and in touch with myself is a non negotiable. And it used to be. And this is something I talk often with kids like about whatever you do to care for yourself shouldn’t be like because you’re trying to fix yourself or make yourself better.

[00:20:28] But because you want to support yourself and that’s a big journey for me is still learning that these tools that I, that I do consistently are because I love myself, not because something bad is, you know, going to have to happen that I have to be prepared for or, you know, that I have to keep working on, like, I’m not learning, I’m not breathing because I need to be calm all the time I’m breathing.

[00:20:52] Cause it just feels good. So. Yeah. Yeah, that’s that’s some of the that’s a building. That’s my building blocks for care. And I try to be open to new stuff. Like, I’m starting to like get back into my like, tomboy phase, which is again, we had some strange things in the 90s. But I was an athlete like all the time.

[00:21:14] And I let go of that identity for a long time. And so I’ve been playing a lot of softball and like feeling just like very that like, Big energy of taking up space and hitting things. So I try to be open to like, where a lot of inner child stuff, you know, like we got short attention spans. So I try, I try to be open to like, today I want to do this today.

[00:21:36] I want to do this and leave space in my calendar so that those things can happen because obviously running a business, it’s, it’s a lot. And so I try to have support to be able to let that impulsive part of me kind of ride a little bit.

[00:21:52] Ela Miranda: I love that so much. There are some really interesting points there that I love. First of all, I love that you have such a well thought out answer for this. I’m just like want to name that like I’m really proud of you because like that’s incredible. And also like I think it’s really interesting to o the point that, like, care is not coming from a place of, I don’t know, negativity or anxiety.

[00:22:25] I’ve been talking about this a lot recently because I’ve been talking with people about adaptive systems and how, for me, that Like, I guess when I talk to people about this, often their first response to me saying like, Oh, you need to have a lot of options available to you for your support because you don’t really know like when life is going to start lifing and throw some shit in your way.

[00:22:53] And so I get a lot of people who are like, Oh, like That feels like I really need to like, sit here and think of everything that could ever go wrong, ever. And I’m like, Okay, well, my brain doesn’t need any help doing that. I don’t know about yours. So we’re gonna take this in a different direction.

[00:23:19] Emily Griswold: Oh, it’s so accurate. That is so accurate.

[00:23:24] Ela Miranda: so no, I love that. I love that. Like that framing of being like, okay, you know, like, it’s not that everything is terrible. And so I have to like, sit here and breathe because the day is going to be terrible, but sort of focusing on like how it feels and the things that, you know, help you feel the way that you want to feel And also I love the point of allowing room for impulsivity.

[00:23:52] I feel like that is an accommodation that is one of my favorite parts of adaptive systems. Like, I just feel like when I talk to neurotypical people, they have such a focus on like, Oh, well, like, I want to do like all of the same things all of the time. And. I have ones like that too, right? Like I eat the same thing for breakfast every morning and I love it.

[00:24:22] Emily Griswold: Yep,

[00:24:23] Ela Miranda: But I think this idea that like you can Plan for impulsivity is something that is like not talked about really at all and this idea that like, you know You can give yourself space to do these things that you want is just not talked about often in society. Because a lot of society is not based around what you want,

[00:24:46] Emily Griswold: yep, that part, yep.

[00:24:50] Ela Miranda: but yeah, like I, I love that so much.

[00:24:52] And I love the idea that like, that is supportive to you and to the care and to like you being a full person who enjoys the things that you can, know, gets to enjoy trying new things and allowing yourself space for that. Because I feel like that’s a really important accommodation. This idea that, like, I feel like very often as a child, like, I was shamed for my impulsivity. Right? Like, you’re like, oh,

[00:25:22] Emily Griswold: I I don’t know anything about that at all.

[00:25:26] Ela Miranda: right?

[00:25:26] Emily Griswold: 0 percent relate to being, going to a Catholic elementary school.

[00:25:32] Ela Miranda: oh, oh, that’s even worse.

[00:25:33] Emily Griswold: We could unpack those systems. That’s a whole different podcast episode.

[00:25:40] Ela Miranda: Yeah, but like, I think, like, There are still some times, like, even now as an adult, like, sometimes I, like, look at the ways in which I spend and I go, Oh shit, like, there’s that shame coming back because I made an impulsive purchase, or like, that tends to be the place where it shows up, like, the most often in, [00:26:00] like, a negative way, I guess.

[00:26:02] for me now an adult but it’s definitely interesting to see like as I As I acknowledge my needs and as I do this work of like building my own accommodations and like Building systems that work for me I’m realizing that like So much of these things that I was shamed for are actually strengths when they’re given the correct, like, space and guidelines.

[00:26:28] When I’m not sitting here impulse buying, like, every single package of chips in the store, I can give myself space to just walk around and go wherever I want, you know? So, but I think it comes down to, as always, knowing, knowing yourself, knowing what you need, knowing, you know, when, like, I have to have a list when I go to the grocery store, if I want to achieve my goals of, like, being financially well and confident, right?

[00:27:02] Emily Griswold: Well, you know what? And you’re reminding me too, is that a bar, a big part of this. So my partner is autistic and has ADHD and is non binary. So they just have, and they’re a person of color. So they’re just like zero norms, just like all right. And being with them and I have to give them props for this because they’re Their neurodivergence and the way that they embrace the calamity of, like, existing, it it it wears off on me in a po right?

[00:27:37] Cause you after I mean, we’ve been together for four and a half years now, right? So, like, you’re gonna you’re gonna pick up on each other’s phrases and and whatever. But they They used to say to me when we first started dating, they’re like, do you laugh? Like, and I’d be like, of course I laugh. And they’d be like, meh, I don’t know.

[00:27:59] And it’s so funny to think about because if you meet me, you know, today, people are like, you’re so joyous and, you know, so on and so forth. But they really taught me how to, how to have fun and relax. And I think. It’s because of I was just describing this to a school leader today. I had this conversation today and she asked me the question.

[00:28:20] What do you think it is? We were talking about the like of being neurodivergent and holding other marginalized identities and like why those tend to like coexist so often, right? Like being gender queer or being, you know, All the other mixed places that we can, we can inhabit. And I was like, because the, the way that, that I have seen it, is it’s like, you were built for one planet and dropped off on another.

[00:28:58] Right?

[00:29:00] So like, you have all of these skills and strategies for this planet that you didn’t end up on. And now, you’re here, like, what the hell? There’s all these social norms and like, People, there’s a great meme that I will send to you that’s like neurotypical people, like, pretending to say something but not actually saying it, like, and so it’s, it’s what I love and I think the reason why I spend so much time in relationship with neurodivergent folks is because of that, like, is because, to your point, like, that strength That’s been shamed for so long is actually what we should be looking for to how to guide our culture.

[00:29:44] Like, the, that’s, that is where, that’s where freedom is. And so, you know, when I’m working with, with kids and even when I’m working with school staff who are also neurodivergent, who have, you know, are completely underdiagnosed and so on and so forth. Like, that’s why we enter with the gift. Because it’s like, you gotta see that first.

[00:30:06] Cause then once you open that, it is Pandora’s box. Let me tell you, and I’m sure you know that, right? Like, once you start setting up systems of support, and you start providing yourself accommodations, the shit that comes out is like, What? I can do that?

[00:30:21] Ela Miranda: Right?

[00:30:23] Emily Griswold: Like,

[00:30:24] Ela Miranda: Oh,

[00:30:25] Emily Griswold: Yeah, so that, when you were bringing that to mind, it reminded me of, yeah, my partner telling me. That they don’t think that I laugh and then showing me really like by living their example of their truth. Cause they’ve, they’ve transitioned like in, within our relationship, they hadn’t begun their transition until we were, you know, about halfway through our relationship and even that process.

[00:30:46] And the systems associated with, with, right. Like it’s, it’s pretty. It’s pretty miraculous. So this, I know this is not like a love podcast, but I do, I have to give them props and, and it’s, it’s part of, it’s part of why I spend so much time with nerd divergent people and why I feel so much so comfortable and safe.

[00:31:07] I, yeah, because it’s, it is, it’s the world that I want. That’s, that’s the version I want that planet. Like, if we could relocate and start over,

[00:31:17] Ela Miranda: oh, absolutely.

[00:31:19] Emily Griswold: that instead.

[00:31:21] Ela Miranda: Oh, I love that so much. I know it is not a love podcast, but I think it’s important to note too that like, community. is a big part of any support system, right? Like, and sometimes It takes a while to find that community or it takes a while to Find people who will truly support you being in your truth and like being able to accommodate yourself But I do believe that like it’s absolutely possible and That it is really an important An important part, you have to have other people to turn to for support, whether that’s like professionals like yourself, or a therapist, or just friends who like, get it, you know?

[00:32:09] Emily Griswold: Yes.

[00:32:11] Emily Griswold: Well, that’s what I, I talk, I talk about that with families too, right? Cause like, I don’t know about you, but I desperately needed somebody like me when I was younger. That was, well, of course, my parents were not like me. So that was, that was never going to drive, but I really needed, that’s why part of my framework is mentor support.

[00:32:30] And I think sometimes people are confused by that, right? Cause like when you’re seen as having like, as an expert in a field, like the word mentor feels very informal, but I put it there on purpose. Because it is like, I, I, I kind of want to embrace that like weird aught that’s not your aught vibe, you know, like, like, and, and like you said, that’s the community we need because we need it.

[00:32:59] We need a future oriented community, like we think, especially when we think about mental health concerns in neurodivergent youth and like specifically, you know, just pieces that feel like this will never get better. And also there’s nobody like me. I mean that having a, a mentor in that role is like, there’s, there isn’t anything better, there’s no, no better intervention than that, literally.

[00:33:24] And you can look to any scientific study about it. So that’s another piece of it, but we often don’t develop that until adulthood. So imagine having that as, you know. Again, if I had that as a teenager, I would have been even weirder, which who knows how that would have turned out. But nonetheless,

[00:33:41] Ela Miranda: Probably amazing though.

[00:33:43] Emily Griswold: I could have been into squirrels long ago. Who would have thought?

[00:33:49] Ela Miranda: Yeah Yeah, no, like I love that and I love to the idea of an intervention in a way that is Not connected to like drugs Like but this idea that like you can you can intervene with support you can like intervene in someone’s life with like lessons that they need to learn and just Genuinely, like, I don’t know. I love, I love the idea of like found family vibes like that very much has been very important for me.

[00:34:24] Like definitely throughout my youth, I doubt I would be here without the people who stepped up in those roles. And so it’s definitely like something that is so important and that I think a lot of adults don’t always. So I love that I think we’ve talked about this a little bit, but Do you feel like the work that you do and working with people who are traditionally, well, who are, who are considered untraditional, right?

[00:34:54] Has helped you to center that? Ease and leisure like both in your life and in your business and why or why not?

[00:35:02] Emily Griswold: So I’m so happy this question came. We could, we should just ask this question over and over again so we can just keep reminding ourselves. Yeah. I, I think one of the things I love the most about specifically working with kids on the spectrum and kids with ADHD is like the, the deep desire for enjoyment.

[00:35:25] Like, it’s a hardwired piece of who they are. And so much of our school system is spent trying to like, hammer that out of them, right? Like, fixed interests are bad, or like, they can’t perseverate on this, stop saying this movie quote over and over again. And I’m like, bruh, you know that you have a sweatshirt that you wear at home when you feel sad.

[00:35:47] So don’t even talk to me about perseveration. You don’t, you act like you’re high and mighty when we all know we have our things, ours are just quote unquote, socially acceptable because we’ve deemed them. So when it comes to like, yeah, leisure and pleasure, it’s a constant. And it, and it, the good part about it is that when you navigate going there first, it’s already integrated, right?

[00:36:15] Like rather than trying, which it feels like, again, we’re doing things backwards where like. We’ve kind of realized as a society, like, Oh, maybe we should take a nap every once in a while, or like, Oh, maybe the traditional five day work week, 17 hours a day. Isn’t good for us. Right. So we’re like having the conversation, but we’re doing it backwards.

[00:36:38] So we’re trying to like shove it inside of something that’s already bursting. Rather than saying like, starting with pleasure, starting with desire, starting with ease. And like building around that. And I think that’s, that’s work that neurodivergent people are, are literally hardwired for and I wish we did a better job of, of supporting that.

[00:37:04] Because I think like when I look at someone like, and I always will talk about her Temple Grandin, like Temple Grandin is an obsession of mine. Mostly it’s the cowboy fits that she rocks on a regular basis. But when I, you know, when I look at an example of her, I see somebody who just kept going on what they fucking loved.

[00:37:30] And what they were really good at, and essentially were like, I don’t care. Like, you can tell me that I’m a woman. You can tell me that I’m weird. You can tell me that, you know, I can’t scream and cry. You can tell me whatever I want, but I’m about to sit in this cowshoe and I’m about to figure out how to fix this problem.

[00:37:50] And like, I mean, she’s like the pioneer of that. So that’s like part of my freedom goal is that too. And it’s hard, right? Cause like. I gotta pay bills, and I’m under a I live in a very expensive city, like, life is expensive. So it’s, I’m not gonna stay here and be like, I have it figured out, like, no, am I crying about money all the time?

[00:38:14] Of course I am. Am I, you know, like, this week was wild, like, just so much happening, like, and some, and, but it’s also, and, and something I’m learning, a system that I’m learning to, like, And habit for pleasure and ease is to also be okay with that, right? That, that there, there is. That doesn’t have to be another way that I am unkind to myself.

[00:38:38] That sometimes there are weeks that are busy. Sometimes your morning routine doesn’t happen. Sometimes, you know, TV is the answer. And that’s not a, it’s not, it’s not bad. It’s, it’s just, it is. And the nicer you are to yourself in the process, the better off you’ll be. So that’s kind of how I try to center those things as much as possible.

[00:39:00] But again, I’m not here sitting, I mean, I feel like my friends would be like, Girl, bye, you were just freaking out like, two weeks ago. Again, friends that just wholly accept you for who you are, can’t, can’t recommend enough. Ten out of ten.

[00:39:16] Ela Miranda: Honestly, Oh, I love

[00:39:20] Emily Griswold: of me being like, Why am I doing this? Can’t I, should I just go back to being a teacher? Cause like, and they’re like you’re not gonna hate it, and I know it feels hard right now.

[00:39:33] Ela Miranda: Oh, absolutely I literally had a friend call me yesterday and they were like I heard your voice in my head telling me to sit down And I just like need you to like externalize that for me. So I listened to it, and I was like, good, I love this, absolutely, sit the fuck down, like,

[00:39:52] Emily Griswold: Oh, it’s so good. Even your, your email message. Like I, I used to have something similar, but I just, the way that it’s phrased. So if you don’t, if you have not received a message from you, we’ll get this beautiful, first of all, it has a robot, which I love. Second of all it’s just so the way that you, you state your reasoning and you’re like resourcing for email.

[00:40:17] One, I love that I already know all your, like, so many of your values just by getting a response from an email. And two, like, if I was going to work with you, I would already know, like, what I’m getting myself into. Like, it’s, it’s just such a good, like, it’s like a sales page in an email, email response

[00:40:36] Ela Miranda: right,

[00:40:37] Emily Griswold: way.

[00:40:37] So I’m, I, I want to shout you out for that system because. Yeah, it’s just that anti urgency and that’s where, that’s where rest and leisure are.

[00:40:46] Ela Miranda: yes, absolutely Juno is my favorite team member, like, that is the name of the robot who sends out my automated response telling you that I don’t check my email that often, and, genuinely, like, it’s one of my favorite things Thank And I think, like, this is a value that took me a lot of time to learn.

[00:41:12] Because I grew up very, very avoidant of both conflict and conversation in general. And so, it took me a really long time to get to a point where I felt comfortable communicating with people directly ahead of time. And recognizing that communication is actually a kindness, like not just for me, but also for other people because as you said, like, you already know my values, you already know to not expect a response immediately.

[00:41:47] Emily Griswold: Right.

[00:41:47] Ela Miranda: So you can set your expectations, and it doesn’t lead to this. Like, miscommunication or like, differing expectations because, because we didn’t communicate, right? And that’s not to say that it’s not still scary sometimes, like, saying directly what it is that I need, The whole point of building these systems is that most of it is automated And I don’t have to say the thing like I don’t have to look at that email every time it goes out That’s Juno’s job

[00:42:25] Emily Griswold: Sometimes, yes, sometimes systems are, sometimes support is having a block. sometimes your most supportive measures are the ones that are very hard and like impenetrable.

[00:42:43] Ela Miranda: Yeah, it’s so funny to me, like, how much of my work centers around, like, the therapy work that I have had to do.

[00:42:50] Emily Griswold: my gosh.

[00:42:54] Ela Miranda: Like, I definitely, like, never went into this going, like, oh, yes, I should be a therapist, but like, but these lessons are so applicable to, like, everything that we do, and being able to like, express your needs and, build those accommodations, but also being able to recognize cognitive dissonance, and being able to recognize, right, like, when sometimes the thoughts that I’m having don’t serve me, and I have to sit there and, like, go through a whole process before I recognize that sometimes, because a lot of times these are things that are, like, just…

[00:43:32] so built in. Like sometimes I don’t even notice when I’m being mean to myself because it’s just something that’s like so frequent. And so the more that I am able to recognize when there is that dissonance between the thoughts that I’m thinking and like the ways in which I want to treat myself, the more I’m able to then acknowledge those needs and acknowledge the support that I need in order to meet those needs.

[00:44:00] And so there are a lot of ways in which like, we’re going to be doing therapy together.

[00:44:06] Emily Griswold: Yes. Hell yes. Yes. Well, and you know what? It’s so funny you say that because somebody… Same thing in the same conversation. Somebody asked me today, like, well, what’s, what, why do you call yourself a coach instead of like, you know, what, and I said, I was like, because it’s like being a tennis coach, but for like.

[00:44:27] These soft skills, like it’s, it’s the same thing. And honestly, I am way too sensitive and empathetic to be a therapist. Like I just, I, I can’t do it. And I thought there was points in my life where I was like, maybe I’ll be a school counselor. Nope. I can’t, I can’t take the actual story because it’s just, my humanity is so raw.

[00:44:50] Like I, I mean, I know that’s a boundary, but what I can do is listen and, give you the bumpers, you know, in the bumper lane to be like, okay, let’s bounce off this. Let’s bounce off that. And it, when you were talking, it reminded me of like, this is a vulnerable share, but I appreciate you. So here we go.

[00:45:11] Something that I struggle with in being in this space is that like, I’m not, I don’t have a diagnosis of anything. I don’t really find myself fitting into, I’m, I’m definitely not on the spectrum. I don’t have A-D-H-D, I am weird and sensitive, right? So there’s like these, you know, these, these places. Of course, I’m not, I don’t typically inhabit any box of neurodivergence and or being neurodivergent.

[00:45:35] Sorry. We’ll, I’ll, at some point I’ll talk about the difference in the CE and the nd t, whatever, spelling’s. Not my strong suit, but one of the reasons why, ’cause sometimes I carry guilt of like, why? Why am I serving in this capacity if I’m not formally diagnosed or even even self diagnosed, right? of course the imposter syndrome and The the way that I’ve grappled with that is that I think part of the reason why I was put on also I also do believe I was put on the wrong planet I think I just came from a different one is that like I have to be a bridge So my job is, and I literally will see this sometimes when I do like visioning practices or something like, I’ll see this stone bridge, and I’m always like walking from one side to the other, and that’s what it feels like, like I’m, I’m walking to like the neurodivergent side and and listening and gaining and, and, you know, raising money for squirrels.

[00:46:39] And then I’m like walking back over to the other side. And like, there’s, that’s the, that’s the beauty. I think of what I, what the system that I’ve set up for myself, that I’m still in the process of accepting and loving is like, again, how to fit outside of a norm and to be okay with, with where I am and the gift that I specifically have.

[00:47:00] Cause. You know, it’s hard because you, you want to, you know, you want to connect and you want to relate and there’s a, there’s a, there’s a, what’s the word? I can’t think of the word, the disconnect, you know, when you’re not like part of this community. But I, I think that’s part of my own process and my own system support is like learning that the, the place you inhabit is the place you inhabit and that’s. You’re that’s your, that’s your thing, like owning the place you and have. And it’s funny, right? I talk about it all frigging day long to children, but try and do it to yourself. And you’re like, but I’m the exception.

[00:47:40] Ela Miranda: Oh, absolutely. It’s so much easier to say than it is to do. Fuck.

[00:47:46] Emily Griswold: Incredibly frustrating. Incredibly because like the example that it brings to mind is like, again, I’ll nerd out with the brain. Cause like, I haven’t nerded out enough with the brain yet in this podcast. And y’all people don’t know my kids. I have kids that will count how many times I say brain during sessions because.

[00:48:03] Really? I just think it’s fascinating and I think the more you learn about your brain, especially when you’re neurodivergent, like you can hack your whole life. It’s amazing. But something I think about in this like bridge reference is that like, we know that folks in the autism spectrum often have enlarged amygdalas, which is the fear response center.

[00:48:24] They also have enlarged other insanely creative pieces of their brain. But if that amygdala is given free reign. That can cause a lot of problems in trying to be a part of whatever you want to be a part of to get free, right? So the bridge experience for that is bringing some of those neurotypical strategies for understanding and unpacking things like anxiety or unhelpful thought patterns or like in our practice, I call it the story snake about like, It starts off as this, and then it gets bigger, and then it gets bigger, and then all of a sudden it’s this, like, massive anaconda!

[00:49:03] That is not true! Like, it is, it’s a birthday party! You can go, I promise you! I know you’ve envisioned it, like, a rocket ship landing on the… The Bowling Center, but like, it’s not, we, no. So, I think that’s where another piece of my work is like, bringing our worlds together. Because we do have a lot to learn from each other.

[00:49:27] And not because we’re trying to fix one another, because that’s the garbage that I really can’t stand, right? Is that like, we’re always just, somebody’s wrong and broken, and like, one side or the other is trying to be like, do this more, do this more. And I’m like, no, no, no, let’s actually. Stop and learn from each other so we can both feel better. That’s, I think that’s also some of my, my favorite work too.

[00:49:48] Ela Miranda: Yeah, absolutely. I definitely think like When it comes to my own relationships, the people that I get along with best are the people who are willing to ask [00:50:00] questions and try to understand, right? Like, I, I don’t have a lot of patience for people who are entirely unwilling to learn

[00:50:10] Emily Griswold: Yeah,

[00:50:10] Ela Miranda: because we live in a world where, like, you have access to the internet.

[00:50:16] Right? Like, I think about this all the time because I think, like, to the comments you’ve made earlier about how accepting kids are these days. You know, I think about my siblings who are all younger than me, and I think about, like, how for me, coming to terms with, like, my sexual identity and things like that were just, like, such a difficult process for me.

[00:50:42] And… You know, my siblings now and like I talk with them and their friends and they’re just like, yeah, whatever like I tried it Don’t let it mean anything about just like they’re just totally fine. And like they, They like have learned all of these things. They have access to so much information and like, you know There’s arguments for both the good and the bad of that, as there is for everything But just like I don’t think that there’s any excuse for not being willing to listen to someone who has a different perspective than you because you have access to so many different perspectives that you never would have had access to before.

[00:51:25] And I just think that that’s really important. Like it’s one of what definitely one of my personal values, right? Like one of the reasons why I travel so much, why I like I’ve moved out of the country. Why I like do all of these things is because I want to be able to have those experiences with people who are different than me.

[00:51:45] I want to stay in the same place with the same people all of the time. Not that I don’t love the people that I have met and been around, but just that like, there’s so many things that I don’t know about this world and I want to know them all.

[00:52:00] Emily Griswold: Yep. Yeah. Which is another brilliance of being neurodivergent is there’s like a. Like an unwavering curiosity and justice. Like, let me tell you, I have to be like, I need to check myself because you are really on the right side of history and you are nine. Like, wow. You know, like that it’s pretty amazing.

[00:52:27] And, and of course, what I think about is. Like, how do you harness that? Because what we don’t, we also don’t discuss enough is how adolescents is like, which I think is what drew me to work with this population. Cause a lot of my teaching experiences with younger kids, mostly just cause they’re so freaking cute.

[00:52:44] And I just, I really, I think children are the most adorable thing in the entire world, but the reason why I drew myself to adolescence is because like. You are defining your identity and you are separating yourself from your caregiver or whatever circumstances you have of the people who raised you and it really is, it’s not to say that you can never go back and, and, you know, collect the pieces of yourself you left behind because like I’m living proof of that and it sounds like you are too, but it would just be so much easier to take everything with us.

[00:53:18] And that’s, I think that’s why adolescence is such a critical age, that we tend to dismiss as like, hormonal, or like, overly emotional, or, you know, like, their mood swings and all, and we, and we have so many, even as a person who works with teens, it’s easy for me to fall into that, like, You know, they just don’t clean up their room or we have to walk both ways uphill to school or whatever, you know Like those like adult mannerisms are but I think that’s something really That we have to remember as a society is that like how we are treating and what we are shaping for adolescence is, is the defining factor of the next generation.

[00:53:59] And when we look at, you know, the laws that are being passed and the hate that is being directed at children being their expression of themselves. I just, I don’t think the folks that are doing this realize like what the impact of that is. And they will highly regret it, I can tell you that much.

[00:54:20] Because when, and I say when on purpose because those are the kids that I want to be working with. When they get older, they will come for you. And they will remember what has been done. And they are… smarter and more innovative and more creative and more like justice seeking. And I love this generation for that.

[00:54:45] I hate what’s being done to them, but you cannot attempt to stifle. Something this revolutionary and like when you talk about your younger siblings, like, I really, I do feel like this generation, the, the generation of youth that’s coming up now is like they’re, they’re revolutionary and

[00:55:04] Ela Miranda: Oh, absolutely.

[00:55:05] Emily Griswold: don’t accept.

[00:55:06] No.

[00:55:08] Ela Miranda: Like, I have cousins who are, like, on their what’s it called, like, student council or whatever. So, you know, they’re, like, in a position of leadership at their school, right? And they’re, like, fucking organizing walkouts when anti trans bills are being proposed in the state that they live in.

[00:55:26] And, you know, they’re, like, organizing baby showers, and they’re, like, doing all of this shit. And, like… I’m just, I’m so, so proud of them. I had no idea what was going on in the world when I was a teenager. Like, and to be fair to myself, right, there were like external circumstances. I was just trying to survive, right?

[00:55:51] But like,

[00:55:51] Emily Griswold: Yep. Feel you. Feel you. Yes.

[00:55:55] Ela Miranda: But it’s also like, you know, they’re, they’re definitely in some of the same boat, you know what I mean? Like, look at the world that we live in and like, and they’re still out here taking action and they’re still out here, you know. Doing these things and like learning about things and speaking out. And it’s just, it’s so incredible for me to see.

[00:56:19] It’s absolutely like very inspiring. Cause you know, I think about it, you know, like you said, like you got to check yourself, right? If I don’t like sit here and do this scary thing, my 15 year old cousin is going to judge me.

[00:56:33] Emily Griswold: literally, and they will they will literally be like, I’m sorry, did you post about and you’re like, damn, okay, sure. I’m about to, I guess, like, because if you don’t that and I’m like, Alright, alright, I get it. I get it. Thank you. I will take care of it. But I think that’s like so important when you’re, which is why doing like healing work and look at looking and looking backwards is like, So important for ourselves personally.

[00:57:03] And like, I think that’s a huge part. It sounds like when you’re talking about like, that your systems work is somewhat therapy work, because it is like, we, we got to look back at some of this stuff and be like, what did I leave behind? And like, what, what do I need to leave behind? Like, cause there are some things that I’m like, I’m, I used to have two popped collars with the dark underneath and the light on top.

[00:57:28] I would love to leave that behind. There’s unfortunately photo evidence, but I would still like to put it in the past. But, like, I don’t want to leave behind the fact that I was, like, involved in I was a band geek, and I played volleyball, and I loved U. S. history and studying World War II, and, like, I was a multifaceted kid.

[00:57:49] I was never the best at any of those things, and I used to be mean to myself for that, but now when I look back, I’m like, that’s so fucking cool. You had all this stuff that you were into, you know? So that’s another piece that I hope that, that folks will be willing to explore too, is like their own versions of their inner teenager and the teenagers that are standing right next to them.

[00:58:12] Like, what could I learn from my own? And what could I learn from, from this person? Cause if you want hope, look that direction,

[00:58:21] Ela Miranda: Oh, absolutely. I love that so much. And, and I think too, I talk often about the importance of review when it comes to systems because you can’t, you can’t know what to change if you don’t know what’s happened. So yeah, like, I think of, I can’t think of his name.

[00:58:43] I will, I will drop it in the notes somewhere when I find it. But he’s a very, like, famous author. And there’s a quote where he talks about, He was doing some project over the summer and Somebody asked him, Oh, what is it that you like to do?

[00:58:59] And he, like, listed, a whole bunch of different things And they were like, oh, that’s really cool. And he’s like, oh, no, no, like, I’m not good at any of them And… The person that he was talking to was like, No, but, like, You don’t have to be good at all of these things, right? Like, what matters is that you are learning and that you have the opportunity to like, have all of these different experiences I think is what the actual, like, quote was saying, was talking about how life is really fucking short.

[00:59:29] And To have experiences is really like what we are here for. And so if you deny yourself the opportunity for that, because you’re trying to only be good at things, it’s such a waste.

[00:59:46] Emily Griswold: to speak to your point about like accommodations, right? Like I think of accommodations and creating systems of support as a way to be able to do that. Like, cause I think, you know, we talk about this often that like our usual inner teenagers are very like anti like constriction, anti schedule, anti, you know, like structure.

[01:00:12] And one of the things that I think can change that mindset around, you know, Learning your own accommodations and setting up systems of support is that like, they actually allow you, they free you up to be able to do the stuff that you, you can’t, you wouldn’t have been had access to. Right. So like, you know, to the part about the fear response and like the amygdala, like if your amygdala is in a place where it feels At least somewhat safe and supported.

[01:00:43] Then your creativity turns on, then your problem solving skills turn on, then your, you know, risk taking factor is right. Versus when we’re living in like unstructured chaos. And this is where I bring my neurotypical side to neurodivergent folks is like, I know that it feels like trying to implement something like this is me Trying to like, I don’t even know, I can’t even think of a good enough analogy for how upset people get when I, especially teenagers, but when I tell them, and when I show them and they get evidence, right, of, oh, this is actually expansion, like this, this accommodation provides me with X, Y, and Z that is like, I mean, there’s there’s no better reasoning for it.

[01:01:43] That’s why we do it.

[01:01:45] Ela Miranda: yes, absolutely. And I, I love the point too. Like mean, I I’m sure, you know, we all have inner teenagers as well, but, I talk about this. Often with people literally like just this Wednesday in Systems Recess, I had like a whole realization for myself that like, it feels like so much work to set up a system because I don’t think people Take into account how many decisions you have to make ahead of time in order to set up a system.

[01:02:20] And that’s a lot of work, like, especially for a neurodivergent person where, like, you have executing functioning, like, disabilities and making a decision in general is just, like, not always your strongest suit, right? To, like, be asked to sit there and, do nothing but make decisions feels like the worst thing in the entire world. when I have that set up, when I take the time to do that, right, when, when we give ourselves access to those accommodations and to that space, suddenly everything else that I’m doing becomes so much easier.

[01:02:57] Emily Griswold: Whoa! Yes!

[01:02:58] Ela Miranda: I have to like, I have to sit there and I have to remind myself of that every single time I go to build a system.

[01:03:05] And it’s why we have systems recess every week, because I have to constantly come back to this process, because it’s not easy for me. And I think there’s a lot of people who can relate that, you know, the process of like sitting down and reviewing my own actions, even when I’m trying to do it in a self compassionate way doesn’t always feel good.

[01:03:32] Emily Griswold: No!

[01:03:34] Ela Miranda: like, I have to have, I have to have a community around me. I have to have like this built in schedule and this built in support for these things. And like, I have to recognize and like continue to remind myself that coming back to these things is the most important work that I can be doing because it then gives me access to all of these other things that I want to do.

[01:03:59] All of the things that I’m passionate about, passionate about, and the things that I want to do become easier when I support myself. And… I think you used a phrase earlier, like, you have to, like, hack your brain, right? You’ve got to, like, trick yourself into doing these things. And I actually, like, just read a study the other day where a doctor used that exact language.

[01:04:21] And I was like, oh my god! Yes! Like, I feel so seen right now! bEcause absolutely, like, that’s how it feels most of the time. I have to, like, trick myself into doing the things that are good for me.

[01:04:36] Emily Griswold: Yes! Yes! Yes!

[01:04:39] Oh my gosh. I, well, and I like, you know, once a teacher, always a teacher. So I feel like I have to like, I have to give a strategy while we’re on this because I, I wouldn’t be able to. So every week. I, I have a newsletter where I put out teenage brain hacks in under five minutes. So there are these short videos where, because parents and caregivers or neurodivergent teenagers have no time.

[01:05:06] None of us have time, but like if there was a group of people that had the least amount of time, it would probably be those people. And so essentially what I tried to do was take, you know, skills and strategies that are quick, easy and manageable and give them the space to listen in whatever capacity they can and to try something out.

[01:05:25] And so I always end the newsletter that five minute with a what. So like, here’s what to do. So can I give you a what as you’re describing this? So what it made me think of, right, is many of my students think that there are certain things that are pointless, right?

[01:05:42] So like, especially on the spectrum, it’s like, I will never use this. I am not doing it. Thank you. And goodbye. So I always have to come up with like the reason and so on and so forth. But one of my favorite brain hacks is called bridging. Have you heard of this before?

[01:05:56] Ela Miranda: It sounds familiar, but please explain.

[01:05:58] Emily Griswold: I said bridging and I was like, Oh yeah, and I talked about being a bridge. Look how it comes full circle. So bridging is the idea of going from a highly preferred task to a non preferred task over multiple steps. So, you know, for instance, like a go to is video games, right? So if you have a kid that’s like very into video games, it’s going to be really hard to be like, Okay, and now do your homework.

[01:06:21] Which feels like so many of us as adults. especially as entrepreneurs, where we’re like, you know, I am creating a course around like, multi hyphenate passion seekers, like, our brain is like, Yay! And like, then we look and we literally do not have a clean dish, like, to eat off of. And we’re like, well, paper towels then!

[01:06:45] So like, how do you go from that to that? Which is also necessary and like, you know, going to help you have a positive, happy, productive life. So bridging is the idea that you kind of like, slowly back yourself into the non preferred task. By getting to less and less. So rather than, you know, go straight from a video game to a homework assignment, we do something like in my coaching practice where I would say, Hey, like if, if I come in and they’re on video games, which is like a setup for a disaster, I’ll say something to the impact of, Hey, I found this really cool game on my phone in five minutes.

[01:07:23] Can we play it together? Sure. It’s still a preferred task. Because it’s something digital. We’re going to do it together. So I have a little bit more like leeway. There’s like a little bit more space between you and the task. And, you know, it’s, it’s somewhat like novel, like it’s not necessarily something you’ve done before.

[01:07:43] It’s like, you know, a little bit, it has a little bit of spice to it. So that’s the first bridge. So the five minutes up, we do this little game. Then I say, hey, in five minutes, we’re going to try this piece of whatever word, social skill word, social story word, how’s that sound? Okay, we’re going to work on this.

[01:08:02] In five minutes, we’re going to work on the social story for 15. And then we’re going to come back to this. And essentially what it is, is like you’re using those bridges to hack your brain to start because eventually what will start happening is that. It’s just like any, you know, path you walk consistently, your brain will get used to and trust that you’re going to come back to the thing you really love.

[01:08:24] Right. It’s not about getting rid of the video game. It’s about learning how to come off, do things, come back on, you know, like the, the it’s a system, it’s a support. So bridging is like, I love that. And so maybe for your, your folks that are more inclined to say no and get overwhelmed by building a system.

[01:08:45] Sometimes we can bridge into it so that it doesn’t feel so yucky. And that eventually our brain recognizes that, Oh yeah, this is just part of something we do. We go from non preferred to like, okay, to, I really don’t like it back to, it’s a little bit good to, Oh my God. Yay. Dopamine, like my favorite thing in the world and your brain will start to trust you, which is what we really want ultimately is to know.

[01:09:06] Like. I got your back, you know, I’m here with you. I know what you like to do. I’m not going to deny that of you for the rest of your life. So yeah, bridging would be my what for everyone.

[01:09:16] Ela Miranda: love that. And it’s so funny that you say that because I literally, like, just this morning made, like, a whole TikTok about this. I realized, so I’ve been using, like, the 5 Calls app to, like, make calls to my representatives, asking them to call for a ceasefire, right? And I’ve been trying to do it every day, but I haven’t been like very consistent for the past few weeks, like about when I do it. And this week I’ve tried really hard to do it before I get out of bed. And I was talking about the idea that like there’s like a productivity theory called. Swallow the Frog, right, where you, like, wake up and you, like, just do the absolute hardest, worst thing on your to do list first, and then you get it out of the way.

[01:10:02] And I’ve always hated this theory because it is the worst.

[01:10:07] Emily Griswold: Yeah.

[01:10:09] Ela Miranda: Like, this idea that, like, I should immediately go into something that I hate just feels so wrong to me. And also, like, isn’t good for my brain. Like, literally, I have to do the dopamine first, and then I can do the hard thing. And this is something that, like, I’ve learned about myself, but I was laughing at myself because I realized that, like, because I hate phone calls.

[01:10:32] So much that, like, I, it’s not the first thing that I do, right? I wake up and I, like, read my comics and I play, like, the games that have, like, daily challenges or whatever, and then I do the phone calls and then I get up, but… Because I hate phone calls so much, it like, brings my anxiety up to a point where like, I was like, I literally feel like I’ve had a cup of coffee already.

[01:11:00] Like, I am ready to take on the day. Like, I know that A, this probably means that coffee isn’t very good for me

[01:11:10] Emily Griswold: Yeah. Amen. Right. True story.

[01:11:14] Ela Miranda: Like I recognize that like these are things that are like not necessarily the best way to get my body like moving and like doing things, but I also know that it works

[01:11:24] Emily Griswold: Yep. Yep.

[01:11:26] Ela Miranda: and so I was like, you know, like I can see where the point of like doing the hard and scary thing could absolutely like encourage you to do the rest of the things so maybe I can, There is some credence to this idea, although I will not be only swallowing frog but I love that. Like, I love that idea of coming back to things. Because I think to your point that like, you get to a point where your brain can trust you to come back to the thing.

[01:11:58] I think that’s like one of the biggest things. That I struggle with transitions are really difficult for me because I hyper focus on things. And, so, like, I do have, like, tricks, and I try to, like, you know, maintain some form of a schedule because it is helpful for me in, like, getting through those transitions and things.

[01:12:26] But I really like that idea of, like, trusting yourself to come back to the thing that you care about. I started playing Stardew Valley recently, because it’s on Apple Arcade, and it is such a dangerous game because it never ends. There is no real good stopping point. So I’m there all day long.

[01:12:49] Emily Griswold: They knew. They knew who they were. They know their target audience. They

[01:12:53] Ela Miranda: Oh, absolutely. When I first started playing, I literally, like, spent the whole day playing it, and then I was like, okay, like, I like the game, but this is, like, not really helping me get to where I want to be, so I’ve, like, set myself this rule now where, like, I can only play it once I’m done with my work, but I do get to come back to it, right?

[01:13:16] Like, I don’t, I don’t get to open it first thing in the morning because I know I will not close it. But once I’m done with my work, it doesn’t matter. I can spend all night doing that if I want

[01:13:24] Emily Griswold: That’s right. Exactly. And well, and so many times, especially when I work with kids with ADHD and I and my friends that have ADHD too, there’s this sense of like, I don’t have enough time. And also, like, time does not exist. Like, it’s like both at the same time, right? Part of getting part of building a trusting relationship with your brain is is Letting it know that like, one, your attention will come back, right?

[01:13:54] Cause that’s like always a big concern of like, I’m never going to get my attention back. If I take a break, it will never come back. And I’m like, speaking of story snakes. So part of like, yeah, the trusting piece of your brain is learning that like you will come back and you do have that capability and let me show you evidence so that when you get into this mindset of like, if I take a break and go to the bathroom, I will never be able to regain my focus is not true.

[01:14:21] And here I will show you that. Right. So it’s funny when you said that, cause yeah, that, happens all the time. It’s like, Where has time gone? And also I don’t have any time to do anything. And I’m like, let me be the guide to the middle ground.

[01:14:34] Ela Miranda: Right. Oh, man. I feel like I’ve talked about this quite a bit before but It was A real incredible shock for me to realize that balance can be me hyper focusing on a thing and then me hyper focusing on rest. Just like real, real mind blowing for me because like that was absolutely like not something that I was allowed as a child. And… To, like, be able to accommodate myself in that and recognize that, like, you know, it’s okay if I want to, like, only focus on these things. It’s okay if I know I will do better at the thing if I just, like, knock it out in two or three days.

[01:15:21] Emily Griswold: Yep.

[01:15:23] Ela Miranda: And then I have to take two or three days to rest in order to achieve that balance. Like, Because I think it was like, it’s just the word that was this idea of some kind of like a middle ground or a balance was so hard for me. Because it was always taught in the way that like, just seemed really difficult for me to like, be able to make those transitions and do those things.

[01:15:47] Especially when, A lot of what I was being asked to focus on as a child was something that I did not care about. So it’s like, if I found the focus for this, I must take it

[01:16:01] Emily Griswold: That’s right. Yep. It’s like, I found like the special berry inside of a pile of garbage and I will consume until I’m sick,

[01:16:13] Ela Miranda: Oh, absolutely.

[01:16:18] Emily Griswold: Oh, man. This has been great.

[01:16:21] Ela Miranda: absolutely. So, so cathartic. To come back to these things.

[01:16:27] Emily Griswold: Right? So that’s why I’m highly considering offering this to adults because I’m like, you know, we could all go back and reclaim some stuff. So we’ll see. To be determined. You’re hearing it here first, but who knows what’s going to happen?

[01:16:40] Ela Miranda: well, I can promise you that I’m probably going to be the first one to sign up when, if, that is a thing that happens.

[01:16:48] Emily Griswold: Good to know. I already have a supporter. Great. Fantastic.

[01:16:54] Ela Miranda: Yeah, but I do think that like, you know, this process of building accommodations and coming to recognize, you know, where your support can be and how to give that to yourself is such an important thing for everyone. So I hope that people listening were able to learn things from you today.

[01:17:12] I know I certainly have. And if people want to connect with you, they want to learn more about your work, how, where can people find you?

[01:17:21] Emily Griswold: they’ve just searched the dredges of the internet. No, I’m just kidding. So they can find me right now. They can find me at eleven 11 wellness. com. So it’s the word eleven then the number 11 wellness. com. But a lot of the content that I’m posting is mostly on LinkedIn. Cause that’s where a lot of families of the kids that I work with are usually on that space. So you can just find me by my name, Emily Griswold but the best place to find all the cool stuff is in my newsletter. So if you go to LinkedIn, or if you go to my website, there’s a signup form there. And you can every Thursday get a teenage brain hack, which you can either use for yourself or use for your teenager.

[01:17:58] But that’s where people can find me.

[01:18:00] Ela Miranda: Awesome. Oh, I love that. I hope you get so many signups and everybody comes out of the woodworks to come find you because I think your work is absolutely incredible and so necessary. So thank you so much for being here, for sharing all of your insight with us, and thank you for the work that you do.

[01:18:19] Emily Griswold: of course. And thank you for the work that you do because. You’re just continuing the good stuff, and I’m so grateful that people get to learn systems from you in a way that is, like, in service of their liberation. So, we’re on the same team. This was really fun. I appreciate you. I’m so excited to see, I can’t wait to hear all the other people too.

[01:18:41] Ela Miranda: I know it’s gonna be it’s gonna be good. So all right. Well, thank you so much. Until the next episode, may you find ease and joy in the life that you’re living, rain or shine.

One response to “Building Confidence and the Importance of Early Intervention with Emily Griswold”

  1. Monica Strom Avatar

    Way cool! Some extremely valid points! I appreciate you writing this article
    and also the rest of the website is really good.

Leave a Reply

Your email address will not be published. Required fields are marked *